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France mulls all-out burqa ban

Controversial bill divides large Muslim population


 

The debate over face-covering Islamic veils continues to heat up in France, where the government is speaking out in favour of an all-out ban. In a controversial statement today, spokesman Luc Chatel explained President Nicholas Sarkozy’s rationale for a bill that prohibits women from wearing the full veil, or burqa, which, he said, “hurts the dignity of women and is not acceptable in French society.” With government set to discuss a draft bill next month, the Muslim population of France, which, at about 6 million, is the largest of the 27 countries in the European Union, is divided. While some agree with the move, which they say will prevent families from forcing women to cover up, others deride it as an encroachment on personal freedom.

Reuters


 
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France mulls all-out burqa ban

  1. I'm pretty sure it's already illegal to force people to dress according to one's taste.

    But of course, it's perfectly ok for the state to do the same, in the name of "women's rights", if you're in a nation like France. French secularism strikes again, and once as usual it's not striking a blow for tolerance so much as for statist control of the individual.

    • what's next, will they make punk rockers get rid of their mohawks, hippies cut their hair, jews get rid of the beaners and catholic nuns get rid of their head coverings? ..and then frenchmen will then have to lose their berets !

      • test

  2. You sir are an ignorant ! Women are forced to wear the veil or to convert in the French "banlieue" it has to stopped …
    Pork-selling meat shop owners are forced to leave newspaper shop-owner are intimidated if there is some girls with swimsuits on the magazines , don' t tell us what we can or can not do in our own country !
    You are talking about tolerance but the tolerance is a one way ticket with them, hear you will have to tolerate us but you'll have to shut your mouth….
    Secularism is non-negotiable, and this could lead to a civil war …Why won't you comment on article like this, you dhimmi :http://www2.macleans.ca/2010/04/21/report-exposes
    They are totally intolerant that's a proven fact, just the last example coming this time from the USA : http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/tvandradio/761
    And to finish, the truth :

    [youtube BAQ3yDaSoS4http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BAQ3yDaSoS4 youtube]

  3. This was never about secularism. That may be how it is being framed, but really it's just political moves to capitalise on a populist backlash against the large and conspicuous Muslim population in Western Europe. If anyone was watching, that tension has been building for years now. It's just gotten to a point that politicians can't ignore anymore; they are now starting to cash in on it with moves like the burqa and minorette bans. I think the “free expression” vs. “the state” arguments miss the real meat of the issue.

    • You can't wear a cross in public school in France so stop the BS, why not create a new religion and wear masks from "Scary Movie" ?
      You should also know that a lot of women of North Africa origin applauded t this move !! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ni_Putes_Ni_Soumises
      here is a translation of their statement : http://translate.google.com/translate?js=y&pr
      So get your facts straight, and no secularism is not exactly what we call laïcité ….
      For one woman wearing the burka freely how many are forced and more importantly how many will get forced in the future ? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/La%C3%AFcit%C3%A9#Fr
      Just remember if anyone choose not to abide by our rules there is plenty of cool countries for them like Saudi Arabia …

      • Hmmm, I just have a few things to say and I'm interested what think about them….

        You say "There is (spelling error by the way) plenty of cool countries for them like Saudi Arabia…"
        well……..there are millions of FRENCH muslims and you sentence right there demonstrates the Us and Them attitude which marginalizes Muslims. I mean, Im not completely naive and I know that some women have it pretty bad because Islam can be supressive of womens rights……but I also think that individual freedom of conscience and religion is a serious thing, so serious that it is protected by the constitution! I don't think we can just ignore and discount the millions of women who say that they think that the hijab is religious requirement and the thousands that say they feel religiously obligated to wear a burqa. Sure some might be pressured in to it, but is that up to the state to determine? Islam is a religion that Muslims choose and that they honestly believe in. What happened to protecting the freedom of an individual to believe what he chooses?

  4. With the exception of the Lone Ranger and some Super Heroes, Western culture looks upon masked individuals
    as threats equated with gangsters, bank robbers and other assorted thugs. Westerners are not comfortable around individuals whose identities are hidden behind veils.

  5. when men start wearing burqas women can start wearing burqas

    • So, women are only permitted to do things that men want to do as well? Wow, what a paternalistic viewpoint.

  6. Another thing about tolerance and the state's role in protecting it….

    You say in your earlier quote:

    "Pork-selling meat shop owners are forced to leave newspaper shop-owner are intimidated if there is some girls with swimsuits on the magazines…You are talking about tolerance but the tolerance is a one way ticket with them…."

    Well, here you are expressing anger about the fact that Muslims have descriminated against pork-sellers and magazine stores that have picture of women in swimsuits. I'm not exactly sure how the Muslims forced the pork sellers to leave (although if they were in a muslim neighborhood it probably would make sense for them to leave because they wouldn't get much business) or if there have been instances of violence on magazine owners. If any illegal activity happend then these muslims should be caught and punished.

  7. However, what does that have to do with tolerance at a state level? French men are still allowed to sell pork if they want to……….a society that truly favored muslims in an unfair way would be one that legally did not allow a French person to sell pork because it was offensive to Muslims. But that would be ridiculous right? Well…..I just don't see how that is any different to the ban on the burqa……you don't allow a French Muslim to wear a burqa in public because it offends other French citizens…….

  8. Sure you go on about how much of a tragedy this it if you want……but that doesn't help. Europe is changing: there are now muslims in it……..so that means mosques, beards, headscarves………and what do you do when large sections of society what to do this?? do you clamp down on them and oppress them? tell them to go back to saudi arabia??

    Well, that might be what Saudi Arabia does to its citizens……but a liberal democracy that claims to protect religious freedom shouldn't practice this behavior. How can you criticize Muslim countries for not allowing Christian minority adequate rights if you don't allow Muslims adequate rights?

  9. Lastly,

    You say, "don' t tell us what we can or can not do in our own country!"

    Well….Many Muslims are French citizens that have lived there their whole life……..so I think its also their country, whether you want it to be or not…….And you better get used to Islam in France because I don't think they are leaving anytime soon. Even though there might be good reason to limit immigration, its still going to happen. And even without that, Muslims have more kids than other people.

  10. Final thought —-> demand that Muslims follow the law!…..but don't tell them what they should think!!!!

    You can demand a Catholic preist to agree that abortion is good or that contraceptive is ok……all you can do is make sure that he doesn't sanction attacks of abortion clinics……

    in the same way, A muslim citizen is allowed to think that Muslim women should wear a veil……….and you should only incriminate Muslims when he has commited a crime!

    • ***I mean you can't demand a catholic preist to agree that abortion is good…..

  11. There is a fear that surrounds Islam. And I'll agree, Islam doesn't seem to have the best track record…..but there are wayyy too many over generalizations about Islam and often Islam gets blamed for what should actually be attributed to other causes. Domestic violence in areas with high unemployment and low levels of education gets pinned on Islam time and again for instance…..

    I don't know, maybe you don't agree with anything I'm saying, who knows………But I just think that with Millions of Muslims living in France you're going to have to integrate them……and to do that you're going to have clear a space in society for the French Muslim…….and Muslims have to be able to determine what it means to be Muslims (which means they have to be allowed to think that wearing a veil is a religious requirement, believing that is their decision…).

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