Harper promises to compensate Quebec's HST adoption - Macleans.ca
 

Harper promises to compensate Quebec’s HST adoption

Tories say $2.2-billion in compensation won’t hinder cutting the deficit


 

The Conservatives say their promise to compensate Quebec to the tune of $2.2 billion for its adoption of the HST will not have any adverse effect on their efforts to eliminate the deficit by 2015. Last week, the Conservatives signed a deal with Quebec that promised the compensation amount by next September if they are re-elected. Some observers see the deal as a way of assuaging the province after the Tories pledged a multibillion-dollar loan guarantee for the Lower Churchill hydro project in Newfoundland and Labrador. Harper defended the agreement, saying the outlines of an HST deal with Quebec were in the words before the election campaign began, and that “it will not change the overall downward path of the deficit over the next few years.”

The Globe and Mail


 
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Harper promises to compensate Quebec’s HST adoption

  1. The Tory BJ machine is in full swing.

  2. The Tory BJ machine is in full swing.

  3. The BQ were looking for this in the budget, and may have supported the Conservatives if it were included in the budget, thus avoiding this, you know, reckless, costly and unnecessary election.

  4. The BQ were looking for this in the budget, and may have supported the Conservatives if it were included in the budget, thus avoiding this, you know, reckless, costly and unnecessary election.

  5. Is this part of the fiscal framework? Is the government digging us further into deficit? Where do they get off accusing the other parties of fiscal profligacy as they going around offering billion dollar bribes to all and sundry?

  6. Is this part of the fiscal framework? Is the government digging us further into deficit? Where do they get off accusing the other parties of fiscal profligacy as they going around offering billion dollar bribes to all and sundry?

  7. “It will not change the overall downward path of the deficit over the next few years.”

    Well then, I guess a few billion more in social programs and daycare supplements won't change it either.

  8. Uh.. what?

    Given articles like this: http://www.calgaryherald.com/news/Obhrai+criticiz… just how for-granted does he take his base to be? Are they really so enamored that dropping an extra 2.2 billion on to Quebec won't be seen as reason to just stay home on May 2 because nobody at all represents them? This is sad, I'm starting to feel really sorry for CPC supporters, because it really does seem like absolutely nobody is representing their views now, and as much as I might disagree with them, that just ain't right.

  9. Uh.. what?

    Given articles like this: http://www.calgaryherald.com/news/Obhrai+criticiz… just how for-granted does he take his base to be? Are they really so enamored that dropping an extra 2.2 billion on to Quebec won't be seen as reason to just stay home on May 2 because nobody at all represents them? This is sad, I'm starting to feel really sorry for CPC supporters, because it really does seem like absolutely nobody is representing their views now, and as much as I might disagree with them, that just ain't right.

  10. But what are we CPCers gonna do? Vote for the Liberals!?

    Well, maybe. I might. We'll see. Probably not. But I'm at least considering it, right?

  11. I suggest two options. The first, easier of the two, is simply to vote for whoever has the best chance of kicking out the incumbent, no matter which party they're from. If we can get rid of enough incumbents we'll have a change in the system.

    The second, which takes some work, is to do a bit of research, talk to the candidates in your riding — even the fringe and loopy ones — and then vote for the one that sounds like they'll actually represent *you* specifically, and not the party. If you can, find some issue where you disagree with that candidate's party line and ask them to justify it to you.

    Failing that, May 2 is a Monday. Kick back and watch wrestling.. that's always good for a laugh.

  12. I suggest two options. The first, easier of the two, is simply to vote for whoever has the best chance of kicking out the incumbent, no matter which party they're from. If we can get rid of enough incumbents we'll have a change in the system.

    The second, which takes some work, is to do a bit of research, talk to the candidates in your riding — even the fringe and loopy ones — and then vote for the one that sounds like they'll actually represent *you* specifically, and not the party. If you can, find some issue where you disagree with that candidate's party line and ask them to justify it to you.

    Failing that, May 2 is a Monday. Kick back and watch wrestling.. that's always good for a laugh.

    • In Canada MPs can not vote against party lines without consequences so MPs never really represent "you". Hence what we really have is a form of dictatorship.

      • Yes, but before an issue gets to vote, the MPs are in the best position to influence the policy that is developed.

        Not only that, but that "without consequences" makes it clear that they actually can. And if we ever start teaching our MPs again that while the party can kick them out of caucus, we can kick them out of the job entirely, those party imposed consequences will have a lot less meaning.

        • I've actually been pretty happy with my MP. He's helped me out with a couple things in the past couple years.

  13. In Canada MPs can not vote against party lines without consequences so MPs never really represent "you". Hence what we really have is a form of dictatorship.

  14. Yes, but before an issue gets to vote, the MPs are in the best position to influence the policy that is developed.

    Not only that, but that "without consequences" makes it clear that they actually can. And if we ever start teaching our MPs again that while the party can kick them out of caucus, we can kick them out of the job entirely, those party imposed consequences will have a lot less meaning.

  15. Brian does not understand the difference between a one-time payment (as compensation for a deal previously made) and a recurrent annual expense (social programs and daycare supplements).

    Brian's vote has the same weight as every other Canadian 18 years of age or older in his riding.

    Discuss.

  16. Brian does not understand the difference between a one-time payment (as compensation for a deal previously made) and a recurrent annual expense (social programs and daycare supplements).

    Brian's vote has the same weight as every other Canadian 18 years of age or older in his riding.

    Discuss.

    • A one time payment? Puahahaha~!

      This time "HST". Last time, "equalization".

      I'm sure you'll be pleased as punch when Charest converts this into another tax windfall for Quebecers.

      • The federal government's deficit position could take a big, one-time hit to fund Stephen Harper's new election goodie for Quebec: a tax compensation pledge that could be worth $2.2-billion.
        But Mr. Harper said Tuesday that this charge on the books wouldn't affect the pace of balancing the budget.

        Hint: red text on this page suggests a LINK to the main story. If in doubt, you might choose to rely on the helpful "SOURCE" box right beside the aforementioned link. The first few sentences have been provided here for your assistance and enlightenment. You're welcome.

  17. A one time payment? Puahahaha~!

    This time "HST". Last time, "equalization".

    I'm sure you'll be pleased as punch when Charest converts this into another tax windfall for Quebecers.

  18. The federal government's deficit position could take a big, one-time hit to fund Stephen Harper's new election goodie for Quebec: a tax compensation pledge that could be worth $2.2-billion.
    But Mr. Harper said Tuesday that this charge on the books wouldn't affect the pace of balancing the budget.

    Hint: red text on this page suggests a LINK to the main story. If in doubt, you might choose to rely on the helpful "SOURCE" box right beside the aforementioned link. The first few sentences have been provided here for your assistance and enlightenment. You're welcome.

  19. Will someone please explain to me why the adoption of the HST is worth this sort of money – some for the modification of cash registers, accounts and computer programs, but this much??. As a parody of the old saying, "Tell me all the ways you love me'" It is now "Tell me all the ways I can be bought." (How much did Ontario get?)
    BC is probably going to turn down the HST (brought in by Campbell, ex-premier) and Layton said today that the Province should not have to give their "fee" back if the referendum to be held turns it down retroactively. Layton REALLY is out in left field.

  20. Will someone please explain to me why the adoption of the HST is worth this sort of money – some for the modification of cash registers, accounts and computer programs, but this much??. As a parody of the old saying, "Tell me all the ways you love me'" It is now "Tell me all the ways I can be bought." (How much did Ontario get?)
    BC is probably going to turn down the HST (brought in by Campbell, ex-premier) and Layton said today that the Province should not have to give their "fee" back if the referendum to be held turns it down retroactively. Layton REALLY is out in left field.

    • It's a bribe. But only Quebec seems to be capable of getting these things retroactively. Lucky ba$tards.

    • Please read my post below.

  21. I've actually been pretty happy with my MP. He's helped me out with a couple things in the past couple years.

  22. Then by all means vote for your MP again. But (and I'm assuming your MP is the CPC candidate) perhaps before you do, let him know that your vote is wavering, and if he wants to make sure that he gets it and that you don't decide to just stay home on election day, he's got to give you some assurances that he's going to work to make the party stop the things you don't like seeing.

    It's become clear that Mr. Harper will not be deterred from doing absolutely anything he has to in order to maintain power. The only thing I can do, as someone who isn't a supporter of his policies in the first place, is to try to vote his party out, and convince others to do the same. Your power, as a supporter of his party, is a lot stronger — use it. Let them know your vote isn't just up for sale, it's has certain conditions attached to it, and if they want it, then they better damn well start taking steps to meet your conditions.

    After all.. they're supposed to be *our* representatives.. not the party's.

  23. No matter how you cut it the federal government is liable for Quebecs debt, which is far beyond their ability to pay, considering their track record, and inability to conduct above the table business,limiting and foreign investment there, so, Harper has to keep them from falling to such a poor Moody's rank, that their interest rate will skyrocket costing us even more. Its the reason they gave up their language and culture crap. For the all Canadian handouts they require or die! Very, very simple. If he can get them to sign off and go Nation, Harper and Canada will soar. Simple as that.

  24. No matter how you cut it the federal government is liable for Quebecs debt, which is far beyond their ability to pay, considering their track record, and inability to conduct above the table business,limiting and foreign investment there, so, Harper has to keep them from falling to such a poor Moody's rank, that their interest rate will skyrocket costing us even more. Its the reason they gave up their language and culture crap. For the all Canadian handouts they require or die! Very, very simple. If he can get them to sign off and go Nation, Harper and Canada will soar. Simple as that.

    • I don't know if it's that simple, but it's definitely a mutually destructive relationship, at least on the public finance front.

  25. Stupid Quebec, when are they going to leave?

  26. Stupid Quebec, when are they going to leave?

  27. It's a bribe. But only Quebec seems to be capable of getting these things retroactively. Lucky ba$tards.

  28. I don't know if it's that simple, but it's definitely a mutually destructive relationship, at least on the public finance front.

  29. They are never leaving. We don't want them, and nobody wants them. They are a drag anywhere, but have got Canada by the bals but good, they know the constitution better then we do, and know we have to pay for all their debts, and have to keep them in the same style of life the rest of the Provinces have. So that is one quarter of Canada's population, Quebec and french New Brunswick, forever on the take, big time. We will be forced into a North American Union. In fact, we now can't avoid it. Which I am all for. This pathetic patronizing is ridiculous.

  30. They are never leaving. We don't want them, and nobody wants them. They are a drag anywhere, but have got Canada by the bals but good, they know the constitution better then we do, and know we have to pay for all their debts, and have to keep them in the same style of life the rest of the Provinces have. So that is one quarter of Canada's population, Quebec and french New Brunswick, forever on the take, big time. We will be forced into a North American Union. In fact, we now can't avoid it. Which I am all for. This pathetic patronizing is ridiculous.

  31. It's impressive how Harper can't do any of his campaign promises until he balances the budget (ie: after the election after this one)… but he can pull $2 billion out of his rear when Quebec whines.

  32. It's impressive how Harper can't do any of his campaign promises until he balances the budget (ie: after the election after this one)… but he can pull $2 billion out of his rear when Quebec whines.

  33. There is plenty of money available! I mean half your pay goes to taxes! The french will never have to work.

  34. There is plenty of money available! I mean half your pay goes to taxes! The french will never have to work.

  35. For practice, put the money in the middle of the Plains of Abe, and plant land mines all around it. Bet they would learn fast THEN how to avoid land mines! lol

  36. For practice, put the money in the middle of the Plains of Abe, and plant land mines all around it. Bet they would learn fast THEN how to avoid land mines! lol

  37. It appears Alberta would be automatically entitled to the same payment, as in theory, Alberta tax is harmonized for many years since it only has a GST. This Bloc "excuse for an issue" is 10plus yrs old and makes the feds look bad in Quebec. In addition to this dubious HST/PST windfall by Mr. Duceppe, the Bloc is an additional "sink hole" on all Canadian Taxpayers – yes including Quebecers, who have proven by referendum they do not support separation. Separatists are on the Canadian Payroll and then demand funding from FEDERAL Coffers but then they are not / will not be working for "all" Canadians – they should be considered in contempt of parliament and "fired" by Canadians until they work on "all" "our" behalf as per their employment contract in the Canadian House of Commons.

  38. It appears Alberta would be automatically entitled to the same payment, as in theory, Alberta tax is harmonized for many years since it only has a GST. This Bloc "excuse for an issue" is 10plus yrs old and makes the feds look bad in Quebec. In addition to this dubious HST/PST windfall by Mr. Duceppe, the Bloc is an additional "sink hole" on all Canadian Taxpayers – yes including Quebecers, who have proven by referendum they do not support separation. Separatists are on the Canadian Payroll and then demand funding from FEDERAL Coffers but then they are not / will not be working for "all" Canadians – they should be considered in contempt of parliament and "fired" by Canadians until they work on "all" "our" behalf as per their employment contract in the Canadian House of Commons.

  39. Politics have bought PQ off since the conception of Canada. One cannot have a majority without PQ!

    Harper is no exception. PQ is isolated pretty much from his "change Canada so we won't recognize it" one liner so inventive subsidies and buy outs are in line for the guy.

  40. Politics have bought PQ off since the conception of Canada. One cannot have a majority without PQ!

    Harper is no exception. PQ is isolated pretty much from his "change Canada so we won't recognize it" one liner so inventive subsidies and buy outs are in line for the guy.

  41. Excuse me how many provinces are there in Canada? What is good for one is good for all…. Infrastructure across Canada is in such dire straights maybe some money should go there first. Half the provinces are screaming for doctors.. how about that? No but we will buy votes where the election numbers count because the West sure doesn't… Wake up Canada …. vote in some politicians that work for all of Canada rather than a selected few

  42. Excuse me how many provinces are there in Canada? What is good for one is good for all…. Infrastructure across Canada is in such dire straights maybe some money should go there first. Half the provinces are screaming for doctors.. how about that? No but we will buy votes where the election numbers count because the West sure doesn't… Wake up Canada …. vote in some politicians that work for all of Canada rather than a selected few

  43. Harper Conservatives CREATED the current deficit…refused to disclose how many more Billions were being spent…and are still promising Billions:

    "…for Quebec…as much as $2.2-billion in compensation for harmonizing its sales tax with the federal goods and services levy." (in 1991)

    GST and HST HISTORY

    Early 1990s, Mulroney Conservatives forced GST on all provinces, including Quebec. Simultaneously, Quebec began levying and collecting its own PST.

    Late 90s, Maritime provinces combined high PST and GST into HST and were compensated with a sales tax reduction. Quebec did not oppose or seek funds.

    In 2010, HST adopted in BC broadly expanded sources of revenue for Canada by taxing goods and services formerly exempt. The $1.6 Billion was to compensate for basic transition costs for new software, paper, etc. and, most importantly, was to compensate taxpayers for higher sales taxes we were once again forced to pay.

    Under HST, Ottawa dictates to BC which goods and services (formerly exempt under PST) are charged a flat Canada tax levy of 12%. BC has no power to offer exemptions from HST.

    Quebec retains its old PST system, along with power to legislate which GST items are PST taxable and exempt.

    COMMENT

    All provinces were forced to adopt GST in the early ‘90s, and Mulroney Conservatives already compensated provinces for GST setup. Unlike BC, Quebec has not changed its sales tax system since 1991, nor have residents been traumatized by vastly increased Canada sales tax when HST significantly widened taxable goods and services. Revenu Quebec International online states Quebec has PST and GST, while no reference is made to HST.

    Why should Harper Conservatives give Quebec funds to make a HST transition they have not yet made?

    Either Conservatives need lessons in this country's dual tax systems, or Conservatives are banking that few people will recognize a $2.2 Billion bribe for Quebec votes.

    ***
    [X] NO MORE Harper Conservative "Contempt of Parliament"

  44. Harper Conservatives CREATED the current deficit…refused to disclose how many more Billions were being spent…and are still promising Billions:

    "…for Quebec…as much as $2.2-billion in compensation for harmonizing its sales tax with the federal goods and services levy." (in 1991)

    GST and HST HISTORY

    Early 1990s, Mulroney Conservatives forced GST on all provinces, including Quebec. Simultaneously, Quebec began levying and collecting its own PST.

    Late 90s, Maritime provinces combined high PST and GST into HST and were compensated with a sales tax reduction. Quebec did not oppose or seek funds.

    In 2010, HST adopted in BC broadly expanded sources of revenue for Canada by taxing goods and services formerly exempt. The $1.6 Billion was to compensate for basic transition costs for new software, paper, etc. and, most importantly, was to compensate taxpayers for higher sales taxes we were once again forced to pay.

    Under HST, Ottawa dictates to BC which goods and services (formerly exempt under PST) are charged a flat Canada tax levy of 12%. BC has no power to offer exemptions from HST.

    Quebec retains its old PST system, along with power to legislate which GST items are PST taxable and exempt.

    COMMENT

    All provinces were forced to adopt GST in the early ‘90s, and Mulroney Conservatives already compensated provinces for GST setup. Unlike BC, Quebec has not changed its sales tax system since 1991, nor have residents been traumatized by vastly increased Canada sales tax when HST significantly widened taxable goods and services. Revenu Quebec International online states Quebec has PST and GST, while no reference is made to HST.

    Why should Harper Conservatives give Quebec funds to make a HST transition they have not yet made?

    Either Conservatives need lessons in this country's dual tax systems, or Conservatives are banking that few people will recognize a $2.2 Billion bribe for Quebec votes.

    ***
    [X] NO MORE Harper Conservative "Contempt of Parliament"

  45. Please read my post below.

  46. The deficit that matters is the structural deficit. One-time spending of 2.2 billion will not really impact the long-term structural deficit, and may actually decrease it, given the enormous economic benefits of the HST (which the CD Howe Institute has estimated to be in the tens of billions).

  47. The deficit that matters is the structural deficit. One-time spending of 2.2 billion will not really impact the long-term structural deficit, and may actually decrease it, given the enormous economic benefits of the HST (which the CD Howe Institute has estimated to be in the tens of billions).

  48. This really smells folks. Kebec was promised 2.2 billion in the latest budget… Something is not right!!! This is funnelling billions into Kebec again and read this article, it is just not right, any way you look at it. Come on  taxpayer’s federation; open your mouths, loudly!!!

    GST and HST HISTORYEarly 1990s, Mulroney Conservatives forced GST on all provinces, including Quebec. Quebec simultaneously began levying and collecting its own PST.Late 90s, Maritime provinces combined high PST and GST into HST and were compensated with a sales tax reduction. Quebec did not oppose or seek funds.In 2010, HST adopted in BC broadly expanded sources of revenue for Canada by taxing goods and services formerly exempt. The $1.6 Billion was to compensate for basic transition costs for new software, paper, etc. and, most importantly, was to compensate taxpayers for higher sales taxes we were once again forced to pay.Under HST, Ottawa dictates to BC which goods and services (formerly exempt under PST) are charged a flat Canada tax levy of 12%. BC has no power to offer exemptions from HST anymore.Quebec retains its old PST system, along with power to legislate which GST items are PST exempt.All provinces were forced to adopt GST in the early ‘90s, and Mulroney Conservatives already compensated provinces for GST setup. Unlike BC, Quebec has not changed its sales tax system since 1991, nor have residents been traumatized by vastly increased Canada sales tax payments when HST significantly widened taxable goods and services. Revenu Quebec International online states Quebec has PST and GST, while no reference is made to HST.Why should Harper Conservatives give Quebec funds to make an HST transition they have not yet made?Either Conservatives need lessons in this country’s dual tax systems, or Conservatives are banking that few people will recognize a $2.2 Billion bribe for Quebec votes. http://www.nationalpost.com/todays-paper/payment+Quebec+line/4846768/story.html