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Kenney on campus


 

Immigration Minister Jason Kenney spoke about human rights and terrorism at the University of Toronto at an event co-sponsored by the Jewish student group Hillel and U of T’s Campus Conservatives.

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Kenney chatted with the students.

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Hillel member Hagai Kuperman, a former aide to Liberal MP Scott Brison.

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Outside the building was Kimberly Rivera, the first female Iraqi war resister to flee to Canada. She has been petitioning the minister to let her stay in Canada. She brought her baby into the talk for a while too. 

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Kenney on campus

  1. I love Kenney’s permanent five o’clock shadow. He truly is Fred Flinstone.

    • This coming from kermit the blog.

      • Yabba-Dabba Do!

  2. Awwwww. Kim brought her baby.

    Awwwww. Who is a Canadian citizen.

    Awwwww. And Kim won a stay of deportation today.

    Awwwww. And this government’s policy of deporting war resisters receives another blow, courtesy of the courts.

    Awwwww. And Jason Kenney’s nads get another slap. Couldn’t happen to a better pair.

    • “Resister?”

      Deserter. Use the correct terminology, please.

      • Tellya what. When people refer to the Iraq war as “the illegal invasion and occupation of Iraq” every time, I’ll start using your preferred terminology for war resisters. Deal?

        • The war resister/deserter issue is troublesome for me.

          On one hand, I feel that yeah, let them stay (“illegal invasion and occupation” etc etc)

          On the other, as soon as we do, expect a flood of other US Servicemen and women who want out as well. AND more importantly, there really is no better way to stick a sharp stick in the eye of a country that is still one of our allies. I mean it really does undermine their military and foreign policy. Their foreign policy may be stupid, but is this the way we are going to get them to change their mind?

          Bah.

  3. I see from the third photo that all the Young Tories in the province were bussed in for the event.

    • Now if only they could manage to look interested.

  4. I have to say, I’ve got good left-wing credentials, opposed the Iraq war, etc etc etc. But I have a real lack of sympathy for deserters/resisters/whatever-you-want-to-call-thems.

    It would be one thing entirely if we were in a conscription situation. But where they voluntarily signed up to be in the military, they have to pay the consequences. Sure, most people believe the war was illegal, and it probably was, under international law, but that’s a risk you take–that your CiC will send you to a war you either don’t want to go to or you don’t think is right.

    It’s a fine line, since command responsibility isn’t really an excuse for war crimes (i.e. you can’t say “well my commander told me to shoot the [insert ethnic minority]”) so there is some grounds to refuse orders, but how do you avoid getting into a situation where soldiers wholesale disobey their superiors piece-meal when they don’t think an order is right or is legal?

    And, of course, their situation isn’t helped by the fact that the government hasn’t said the Iraq war is/was illegal. If the gov did say that, I think their case would also be stronger.

    • It really isn’t about left or right wing, Brad. It’s about whether the individual has the right to tell the state no, I won’t kill illegally on your behalf.

      And the risk of breaking a contract shouldn’t be imprisonment and a criminal record, should it? Is that in your employment contract? I’m pretty sure it wasn’t in mine.

      You’re absolutely right to bring up the Nuremberg principles. You do have the right to refuse illegal orders. If the order is to participate in an illegal war, you have the right to refuse. Whether your country respects that right is different.

      And I hardly think that a country admitting it is currently waging an illegal war is a fair litmus test for resisters’ legitimacy. A better one might be whether the UN sanctions the military action.

  5. I totally agree with the posters above about the difference between avoiding conscription and desertion. When you sign up voluntarily to serve your country and then turn around and get picky about which war you will or will not fight or which action you will or will not take as fas as I am concerned you forfeit the right to avoid serving and drop up to canada for a bit on the side and a baby in the boot..

    • Yeah, Wayne, those resisters are just so picky. They don’t seem to care that, even if the war is illegal, the USA really, really wanted to invade Iraq. Shameless!

      The rest of your comment is a little garbled. Would you like to try again in English?

      • So I will ask again. Are you okay with other law breakers heading over our boarders for asylum?

        • No, i think we shoulda kept W out!!

        • I answered your question above. But I’ll answer your oversimplification of the issue with an oversimplification of my own: would you have refused asylum for Nelson Mandela, if he had wanted to escape to Canada? How about Gandhi? They were both law breakers.

          And how about the 50,000+ Americans who fled to Canada during the Vietnam war (including 3000 deserters)? Would you have sent them back, too?

        • This whole “either NO lawbreakers can be allowed to come to Canada or ALL law breakers must be allowed to come to Canada” is a completely specious straw man on your part glak.

          I sometimes think this sort of absolutism is just a convenient excuse for some people to never have to think about anything.

          • You only think that “sometimes”? I get that impression every time I read a Con talking point…

      • you sign a contract you meet your obligations else stay away from canada – is that less garbled as it were?

    • Yeah, they don’t have the luxury of the Cheneys, Rummies, Wolfies and Bush jrs of this world. The chicken hawks never need to run, or face charges of desertion – do they? Must be nice to make the rules up as you go along. Not that i’m arguing for avoiding committments that you should have known would face you in a warrior society like the US ; just a little perspective please!

  6. Someone needs a genital cuff, but it isn’t Kenney.
    You lefties never think things through to their conclusion.
    If one group of law breakers is allowed to take haven here, why not others?
    How about anti-abortion, anti-gay marriage, anti-Obama activist who break US law?
    If there’s a type of law breaker your not willing to harbor then you appear hypocritical.

    • “You lefties never think things through to their conclusion.”

      Oh, sure, and the right wing of the spectrum is renowned for thinking things through. Mission accomplished!

      But I think you misunderstand the resisters’ case. They are treated harshly by their government for the legal act of refusing to follow an illegal order. And they receive differential treatment because they are critical of their government in doing so.

      That the Canadian government, not to mention a third of Canadian citizens (in the latest Angus Reid poll — yes, the anti-resister faction represented here is by far the minority view), would rather support the Bush wars than those who object to them says a lot, I think.

    • If there’s a type of law breaker your not willing to harbor then you appear hypocritical.

      That’s exactly the kind of absolutism that leads to the CPC still having members who insist on referring to Nelson Mandela as a terrorist.

      • Specifically, the CPC had one member who said this – kooky Rob Anders. Every other MP honoured Mandela.

      • Well, I take your point CR, but what you’re saying is that the CPC only had one elected member in the HOUSE OF COMMONS who insists on calling Mandela a terrorist,and was willing to be the sole vote against his honourary citizenship.

        Rob Anders does keep getting elected somehow though, which suggests that he may not be the only member in the entire party who thinks that way.

      • CR
        Fooey! They were thinking it!

    • ..think things through? Better than the likes of you who don’t think at all. MYL – charming – such class. You mother didn’t do a very good job.

  7. Since when did The Contract become so bloody sacred? And how can someone describe themself as a lefty who opposes the illegal U.S. war against Iraq, and then express more concern about military discipline than the rights of a conscientious objector?

    If you had a little taste of the Iraq war, as many of the war resisters have, then you wouldn’t consider them “picky” in refusing to go back to kill more Iraqi civilians, or to die in a roadside bombing.

    Finally, have you ever heard the mandate, “Thou Shalt Not Kill”? Where is the fine print that says “unless on a massive scale as ordered by the President of the United States.”…

    There are more than a few contradictions floating around in our heads. Apparently the debate over granting a safe haven to war resisters causes several of them to crash into one another.

    People should be punished for killing other human beings and resorting to violence. Those who choose to do otherwise should never be criminalized.

  8. Remember the photos comparing George Bush at the start of his first term compared to how he looked leaving office? Public life is hard on you…
    compare the above photos of Kenney to the one on the masthead of his website: http://www.jasonkenney.com/

  9. I feel a stereotype coming on…

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