29

On how federalist parties are faring in Quebec

Martin Patriquin and Philippe Gohier hash it out


 

 
Filed under:

On how federalist parties are faring in Quebec

  1. Can anyone explain to me why they vote the way they do in Quebec? I have never been there, and wonder if they really want to separate, or if voting in the Bloc is strategic in another way?
    I just wish they would embrace Canada, and we could all start moving forward.

  2. Can anyone explain to me why they vote the way they do in Quebec? I have never been there, and wonder if they really want to separate, or if voting in the Bloc is strategic in another way?
    I just wish they would embrace Canada, and we could all start moving forward.

    • The Bloc is first and foremost a separatist party but it is also the most social/leftist party in Canada. This sometimes entices those who want their social services protected even if they have no want or need to separate. It's a pretty good strategy for the Bloc. Let's face it, in a Federal Election, it'd be next to impossible for the Bloc to get enough of the vote to be strong enough to separate so they are not a threat at this level of government,

    • The same reason Albertans keep voting for the Conservatives: The Bloc is Quebec's home team.

      • But the conservative are a national party, that doesn't represent just Alberta, and isn't set to break up the country. I am not trying to start a fight, just to see someone else's rational.

    • Quebec is special. That's about all you need to know.

  3. The Bloc is first and foremost a separatist party but it is also the most social/leftist party in Canada. This sometimes entices those who want their social services protected even if they have no want or need to separate. It's a pretty good strategy for the Bloc. Let's face it, in a Federal Election, it'd be next to impossible for the Bloc to get enough of the vote to be strong enough to separate so they are not a threat at this level of government,

  4. The same reason Albertans keep voting for the Conservatives: The Bloc is Quebec's home team.

  5. If you had a party who's primary concern was the wellbeing of your province, and who's advocacy focused on the needs of your province, don't you think you'd be interested?

  6. Nobody in Quebec (aside from a very few diehards) cares about separation anymore. The debate is over and Canada won.
    This cannot be emphasized enough! Separation is seen as the older generation's issue, and most of the boomers who fervently wanted an independent Quebec care more about spending their winter vacations in Cuba with grandchildren than they do anything else.

    Heck, there's an argument to be made that most Quebecers would be happy to see Bill 101's restrictions on language of education eased off a bit (although this is a tricky minefield, because in French, the concepts of language and culture are much more closely tied together than they are in English).

    Rural Quebecers are voting for the Bloc now mostly because no federal party appeals to them. The NDP platform is probably closest to what rural Quebecers want — a strong socialist caring government.
    Start talking gun control, abortion opposition, anti-gay marriage, and you lose that rural vote. Talk about restricting niqabs and immigration and you'd win the votes of people who probably won't encounter more than a dozen muslims in their entire lives.

  7. Nobody in Quebec (aside from a very few diehards) cares about separation anymore. The debate is over and Canada won.
    This cannot be emphasized enough! Separation is seen as the older generation's issue, and most of the boomers who fervently wanted an independent Quebec care more about spending their winter vacations in Cuba with grandchildren than they do anything else.

    Heck, there's an argument to be made that most Quebecers would be happy to see Bill 101's restrictions on language of education eased off a bit (although this is a tricky minefield, because in French, the concepts of language and culture are much more closely tied together than they are in English).

    Rural Quebecers are voting for the Bloc now mostly because no federal party appeals to them. The NDP platform is probably closest to what rural Quebecers want — a strong socialist caring government.
    Start talking gun control, abortion opposition, anti-gay marriage, and you lose that rural vote. Talk about restricting niqabs and immigration and you'd win the votes of people who probably won't encounter more than a dozen muslims in their entire lives.

    • Talk about restricting niqabs and immigration and you'd win the votes

      That's probably why the Liberals are running a white supremacist in northern Quebec.

      • Were running. You're getting your tenses mixed up.

        • In fact, Mr. Forbes will still be listed on the ballot in Manicouagan as a Liberal.

          This is because (a) he was duly nominated by his party, (b) he met the requirements for getting on the ballot with Elections Canada, which included (c) obtaining a signed letter from the Liberal leader endorsing him as their candidate in Manicouagan, and (d) under the Elections Act, a party can't endorse more than one candidate on the ballot, and since (e) Mr. Forbes is not stepping down voluntarily, according to his news conference earlier today in Sept-Iles, and (f) there is no provision in the Elections Act for a party leader to revoke that endorsement, (g) therefore they are stuck with him.

          He says he's still running. And he will have the party affiliation "Liberal" next to his name, and yes, they will collect the $2/vote for any votes he receives.

          That's the law.

    • Although a minority (30%-40%) of people are diehard separatists, the separation issue is far from dead. You must be either very young or very naive to think otherwise. The reasons for which the issue is not as important today are many (fatigue over the issue, PQ out of power for a long time, the domination of the bloc on the federal scene, convervative government leaving the provinces pretty much to do as they please, etc), but the underlying reality is that french quebec and the rest of canada are socially/politically two distinct entities that pretty much ignore each other. Conflicts are bound to occur again and again on a regular basis.

      Also, rural Quebecers are more likely to dislike the center-left positions of the bloc than urban Quebecers. This has been used by the conservatives during this election by saying that the bloc is a Montreal party.

      • I'm neither young nor naive, and I'm not disagreeing that there are linguistic differences (one of those being rural Quebecers are closer to urban Montrealers in attitude than they are to rural RoCers). But the dispute is over and the hatchet is on its way to being buried, because the reasons for the dispute are gone.

        I talk to my friends, colleagues, and neighbours who strongly supported separation in one or both of the previous referendums– and hear how now they are nearing (or have already reached) retirement, realize that there is no longer any point.
        The people I bought my house from are a perfect example. They've gone from being card-carrying pequistes who attended rallies and political meetings to living on a beach down south whose only connection to this country is their medicare card.

        When I talk to people under 35, there's pretty much a rude split to be made. If they have ambition, they want to be bilingual, have their children be bilingual, and want economic success – which they freely admit will be impossible in a separate Quebec. These same people may vote Bloc because they don't like the other federalist parties. In the provincial political side, they are the ones supporting Francois Legault and hoping he makes a political party they can support.

  8. but can't a federal party look out for the well-being or a province?

  9. but can't a federal party look out for the well-being or a province?

    • Of course it can. But a party that specializes is more likely to represent what you want, and not what the rest of Canada wants.

      Think about it this way:

      There are plenty of nationalists that vote BQ in Quebec. Why do you think that a nationalist would vote for a separatist party? It isn't because they want to separate, its because they want their voice heard.

      On the other hand, if you live in Alberta, the Conservatives may be your home team, but they're so busy courting the rest of the country that your voice doesn't get heard. You don't even get a response to your emails. Or, at least, not until election time.

  10. But the conservative are a national party, that doesn't represent just Alberta, and isn't set to break up the country. I am not trying to start a fight, just to see someone else's rational.

  11. Quebec is special. That's about all you need to know.

  12. Talk about restricting niqabs and immigration and you'd win the votes

    That's probably why the Liberals are running a white supremacist in northern Quebec.

  13. Of course it can. But a party that specializes is more likely to represent what you want, and not what the rest of Canada wants.

    Think about it this way:

    There are plenty of nationalists that vote BQ in Quebec. Why do you think that a nationalist would vote for a separatist party? It isn't because they want to separate, its because they want their voice heard.

    On the other hand, if you live in Alberta, the Conservatives may be your home team, but they're so busy courting the rest of the country that your voice doesn't get heard. You don't even get a response to your emails. Or, at least, not until election time.

  14. Were running. You're getting your tenses mixed up.

  15. Although a minority (30%-40%) of people are diehard separatists, the separation issue is far from dead. You must be either very young or very naive to think otherwise. The reasons for which the issue is not as important today are many (fatigue over the issue, PQ out of power for a long time, the domination of the bloc on the federal scene, convervative government leaving the provinces pretty much to do as they please, etc), but the underlying reality is that french quebec and the rest of canada are socially/politically two distinct entities that pretty much ignore each other. Conflicts are bound to occur again and again on a regular basis.

    Also, rural Quebecers are more likely to dislike the center-left positions of the bloc than urban Quebecers. This has been used by the conservatives during this election by saying that the bloc is a Montreal party.

  16. In fact, Mr. Forbes will still be listed on the ballot in Manicouagan as a Liberal.

    This is because (a) he was duly nominated by his party, (b) he met the requirements for getting on the ballot with Elections Canada, which included (c) obtaining a signed letter from the Liberal leader endorsing him as their candidate in Manicouagan, and (d) under the Elections Act, a party can't endorse more than one candidate on the ballot, and since (e) Mr. Forbes is not stepping down voluntarily, according to his news conference earlier today in Sept-Iles, and (f) there is no provision in the Elections Act for a party leader to revoke that endorsement, (g) therefore they are stuck with him.

    He says he's still running. And he will have the party affiliation "Liberal" next to his name, and yes, they will collect the $2/vote for any votes he receives.

    That's the law.

  17. Personally, I can't vote for the Conservatives because I disagree with many of their values. Same for the NDP but unlike Harper, Jack Layton is friendly and really liked in Quebec. About Liberals, they still have the corruption stigma here and that's why people don't vote for Liberals outside Montreal. If Liberals can prove to Quebecers they have changed, maybe they will vote Liberals.____Quebecers don't have many choices and it's a strategic vote to vote Bloc Québécois. Gilles Duceppe proved he really worked for our interests unlike Harper who's sold to oil companies. I used to be a separatist but I changed my mind. Canada is a great country and I'm glad to be born here. But actually, I don't understand how canadians can support the Conservatives who clearly demonstrate they only care about themselves and never hesitate to create conflicts between provinces to push it's own agenda.____Liberals and Conservatives think they can buy us with more money but it doesn't work that way. __As long as federal parties will fail to defend our interests (I'm not talking about more money), we'll continue to vote for Bloc because they really work for us, not some oil business.

  18. Personally, I can't vote for the Conservatives because I disagree with many of their values. Same for the NDP but unlike Harper, Jack Layton is friendly and really liked in Quebec. About Liberals, they still have the corruption stigma here and that's why people don't vote for Liberals outside Montreal. If Liberals can prove to Quebecers they have changed, maybe they will vote Liberals.____Quebecers don't have many choices and it's a strategic vote to vote Bloc Québécois. Gilles Duceppe proved he really worked for our interests unlike Harper who's sold to oil companies. I used to be a separatist but I changed my mind. Canada is a great country and I'm glad to be born here. But actually, I don't understand how canadians can support the Conservatives who clearly demonstrate they only care about themselves and never hesitate to create conflicts between provinces to push it's own agenda.____Liberals and Conservatives think they can buy us with more money but it doesn't work that way. __As long as federal parties will fail to defend our interests (I'm not talking about more money), we'll continue to vote for Bloc because they really work for us, not some oil business.

  19. I'm neither young nor naive, and I'm not disagreeing that there are linguistic differences (one of those being rural Quebecers are closer to urban Montrealers in attitude than they are to rural RoCers). But the dispute is over and the hatchet is on its way to being buried, because the reasons for the dispute are gone.

    I talk to my friends, colleagues, and neighbours who strongly supported separation in one or both of the previous referendums– and hear how now they are nearing (or have already reached) retirement, realize that there is no longer any point.
    The people I bought my house from are a perfect example. They've gone from being card-carrying pequistes who attended rallies and political meetings to living on a beach down south whose only connection to this country is their medicare card.

    When I talk to people under 35, there's pretty much a rude split to be made. If they have ambition, they want to be bilingual, have their children be bilingual, and want economic success – which they freely admit will be impossible in a separate Quebec. These same people may vote Bloc because they don't like the other federalist parties. In the provincial political side, they are the ones supporting Francois Legault and hoping he makes a political party they can support.

Sign in to comment.