Denis, Denis

Coderre’s resignation, writes Andrew Coyne, was the political equivalent of a suicide bombing

Denis, DenisIt was predictable enough that Denis Coderre would resign his position as the Liberals’ Quebec “lieutenant” in the wake of Michael Ignatieff’s decision to overrule him in the matter of who should carry the party banner in Outremont. Indeed, after such a public rebuff he could hardly do otherwise: his credibility was shot.

What was not so predictable, perhaps, was that he would do so in such a spectacularly destructive, and self-destructive, fashion: the political equivalent of a suicide bombing. To claim that he was the victim of a Toronto-based cabal — one that, by implication, also held Quebec in its grip — is a particularly incendiary charge in Quebec, ever alert to signs of Anglo domination.

It’s not true, of course: Coderre is not Quebec, and many if not most members of the Liberal Party in Quebec would prefer Martin Cauchon to Denis Coderre as their standard-bearer. Amongst those Liberals, I’d guess, would be a majority of the Quebec caucus, plus the party executiveand Jean Chretien.

But it would be no less unforgiveable if it were true. He has not only handed the party’s rivals a durable attack line in Quebec, but has grievously wounded the leader he pretends to support. And while this performance has in all likelihood extinguished whatever slim hopes Coderre might have had of succeeding him as leader, he has also effectively smeared Cauchon as an Uncle Tom, supplicant to les autres. All in the space of about three minutes.

It’s hard to muster much sympathy for Ignatieff, or his circle. It was, after all, that same Toronto cabal that conferred the Quebec captaincy on Coderre, in the apparent belief that he would discard the habits of a political lifetime and put the party’s interests before his own. But then, the apple doesn’t fall far from the leader, does it? I’m told Iggy himself used to say the most shockingly disloyal things when Stephane Dion was leader.

Granted, with more discretion than Coderre. But that’s hardly saying much.

UPDATE: You want to know the worst part of this? It means we have to listen to lectures on loyalty from Jean Lapierre.

UPPERDATE: Good lord, talk about setting the bar low:

Michael Ignatieff is refusing to retreat in Quebec, defiantly showing up at a party fundraiser in suburban Montreal Tuesday night to signal to Liberals that he is still in charge.

Liberal leader shows up at Liberal fundraiser in Liberal stronghold of Montreal. Gutsy.




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Denis, Denis

  1. Iggy was playing with fire when he appointed Coderre. I think Chretien was skilled at handling bullies like Coderre, while Iggy might have over-estimated his ability to control such a strong personality.

    • Chretien was (skilled at it) because…..Chretien was (a bully himself)

      Thats not a criticism, just a partial explaiantion for himself. Iggy just bullied his brother, that doesnt work without the family psyco drama.

  2. Was Coderre slim before he was elected in 1997?

    Yes? He'll now lose weight.

  3. But then, the apple doesn't fall far from the leader, does it? I'm told Iggy himself used to say the most shockingly disloyal things when Stephane Dion was leader.

    I remember hearing the same thing. In fact, when I originally heard about Coderre's plan to replace Stephane Dion with a rookie female candidate, I assumed that Ignatieff had already signed off on the plan to get rid of his former rival. There isn't much love lost between those guys. Consider this CTV News report on May 30, 2008:

    Some of Stephane Dion's top advisers are planning to press the Liberal leader in the coming days to dump Michael Ignatieff as deputy leader, CTV News has learned.

    Dion said today he has great confidence in Ignatieff and no one should worry about rumours. Ignatieff insisted on CTV's Question Period on Sunday that he has not been disloyal, saying his job "is to make (Dion) the next prime minister of Canada."

    But some in the Dion camp believe that that Ignatieff, Dion's former leadership rival, is privately undermining the Liberal leader with critical and disdainful remarks.

    Earlier this week, Dion demanded an end to the political sniping within his party after several shots were made at his leadership.

    <a href="http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNe…” target=”_blank”>http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNe

  4. But then, the apple doesn't fall far from the leader, does it? I'm told Iggy himself used to say the most shockingly disloyal things when Stephane Dion was leader.

    I remember hearing the same thing. In fact, when I originally heard about Coderre's plan to replace Stephane Dion with a rookie female candidate, I assumed that Ignatieff had already signed off on the plan to get rid of his former rival. There isn't much love lost between those guys. Consider this CTV News report on May 30, 2008:

    Some of Stephane Dion's top advisers are planning to press the Liberal leader in the coming days to dump Michael Ignatieff as deputy leader, CTV News has learned.

    Dion said today he has great confidence in Ignatieff and no one should worry about rumours. Ignatieff insisted on CTV's Question Period on Sunday that he has not been disloyal, saying his job "is to make (Dion) the next prime minister of Canada."

    But some in the Dion camp believe that that Ignatieff, Dion's former leadership rival, is privately undermining the Liberal leader with critical and disdainful remarks.

    Earlier this week, Dion demanded an end to the political sniping within his party after several shots were made at his leadership.

    <a href="http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNe…” target=”_blank”>http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNe

  5. But then, the apple doesn't fall far from the leader, does it? I'm told Iggy himself used to say the most shockingly disloyal things when Stephane Dion was leader.

    I remember hearing the same thing. In fact, when I originally heard about Coderre's plan to replace Stephane Dion with a rookie female candidate, I assumed that Ignatieff had already signed off on the plan to get rid of his former rival. There isn't much love lost between those guys. Consider this CTV News report on May 30, 2008:
    .
    .
    "Some of Stephane Dion's top advisers are planning to press the Liberal leader in the coming days to dump Michael Ignatieff as deputy leader, CTV News has learned.

    Dion said today he has great confidence in Ignatieff and no one should worry about rumours. Ignatieff insisted on CTV's Question Period on Sunday that he has not been disloyal, saying his job "is to make (Dion) the next prime minister of Canada."

    But some in the Dion camp believe that that Ignatieff, Dion's former leadership rival, is privately undermining the Liberal leader with critical and disdainful remarks.

    Earlier this week, Dion demanded an end to the political sniping within his party after several shots were made at his leadership."

    <a href="http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNe…” target=”_blank”>http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNe

  6. "he could hardly do otherwise: his credibility was shot."

    Would we have any pols at all if they had to resign due to loss of credibility?

    I would argue neither Coderre or Iggy have little credibility after the past week's events because the Dear Leader came out in support of Denis before deciding to use the stiletto.

    "Granted, with more discretion than Coderre."

    Boo. Down with discretion, give us more gossip and innuendo please.

    Denis, Denis is my favourite Blondie song.

  7. "he could hardly do otherwise: his credibility was shot."

    Would we have any pols at all if they had to resign due to loss of credibility? We would have different PM every week.

    I would argue both Coderre or Iggy have little credibility after the past week's events because the Dear Leader came out in support of Denis before deciding to use the stiletto.

    "Granted, with more discretion than Coderre."

    Boo. Down with discretion, give us more gossip and innuendo please.

    Denis, Denis is my favourite Blondie song.

  8. "he could hardly do otherwise: his credibility was shot."

    Would we have any pols at all if they had to resign due to loss of credibility? We would have different PM every week.

    I would argue neither Coderre or Iggy have little credibility after the past week's events because the Dear Leader came out in support of Denis before deciding to use the stiletto.

    "Granted, with more discretion than Coderre."

    Boo. Down with discretion, give us more gossip and innuendo please.

    Denis, Denis is my favourite Blondie song.

  9. Disclosure: I don't like Denis Coderre.

    The problem is that Denis Coderre is the guy doing all the hard work for the Liberal Party in Quebec.

    Most of the Montreal crowd are just waiting for their entitlements to flow down from the Desmarais-Chretien-RAe-Cauchon old guard establishment.

    So there in a nutshell is the problem. The old guard, who doesn't do any of the work, and still wants to be entitled to their entitlements, and Denis Coderre, the guy trying to rebuild the party in outside of the safe havens for the old guard in Montreal.

  10. "I'm told Iggy himself used to say the most shockingly disloyal things when Stephane Dion was leader."

    I hadn't heard that but I'm not at all impressed by hearing about it. It certainly sets a bad example for the rank and file – and it could come back to haunt Iggy.

    • Jarrid's tears for Dion now can be placed in the Ripley's Believe it Or Not museum…

  11. But then, the apple doesn't fall far from the leader, does it? I'm told Iggy himself used to say the most shockingly disloyal things when Stephane Dion was leader.

    I remember hearing the same thing. In fact, when I originally heard about Coderre's intention to replace Stephane Dion with a rookie female candidate, I assumed that Ignatieff had already signed off on the plan to get rid of his former rival. There isn't much love lost between those guys. Consider this CTV News report on May 30, 2008:
    .
    "Some of Stephane Dion's top advisers are planning to press the Liberal leader in the coming days to dump Michael Ignatieff as deputy leader, CTV News has learned.

    Dion said today he has great confidence in Ignatieff and no one should worry about rumours. Ignatieff insisted on CTV's Question Period on Sunday that he has not been disloyal, saying his job "is to make (Dion) the next prime minister of Canada."

    But some in the Dion camp believe that that Ignatieff, Dion's former leadership rival, is privately undermining the Liberal leader with critical and disdainful remarks.

    Earlier this week, Dion demanded an end to the political sniping within his party after several shots were made at his leadership."

    <a href="http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNe…” target=”_blank”>http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNe

    • "with critical and disdainful remarks."

      Surely many/most cabinet members think they are the bee's knees and could do better than the boss. Bad mouthing is only a real problem if it goes public. If Dion had been a decent leader, Iggy could call him a wanker all he wanted to and it would not have made a difference. Iggy would have been ignored or ostracized.

    • And we already know that SD is has a vindictive streak in him. Iggy needs friends right now….and unfortunate for him the cold embrace of Bob Rae and Jean Chretien is his only protection. They will run him like a marionette until they dont need him.

  12. At a time when Iggy is struggling to justify why he should be given the reigns of government, we're treated to this fairly ugly public spectacle.

    Talk about blowing a job interview.

  13. I heard Harper used to say some pretty bad things about Stockwell Day and Peter MacKay. MacKay and Belinda used to place crank calls to Harper's red emergency phone.

    • And when Harper is at his weakest those things may come back to haunt him….alternatively, he has given both those ministers a chance to shine…..so some of the sting might be gone.

      In some ways all political leaders go thrugh trials by fire within their party, even after they win. For all the doom and gloom, and there is lots of it, it is an oppotunity…..but we will see how he deals with it.

  14. No mention of Bob Rae? No mention of Chretien meddling?

    MI's bff, Rae, who publicly questioned his leader's decision to reject Cauchon in favour of Coderre's pick!

    MI stabs Cauchon, Rae stabs MI, MI stabs Coderre, Coderre stabs MI, Cauchon and the OLO….sweet

    • Glad you continue to support the idea of appointing candidates. Those who dare speak in favour of grassroots democracy should be pillared from post to post, just like that poor CON candidate in Guelph a year ago. Your idle musings will be noted as CON firestarting.

  15. It'll be interesting to see if the Coderre affair will show up in the polls, particularly in Quebec where the Libs had been having some limited success under Iggy.

    In question period today, as Chantal Hébert points out on her "blogue", the first 7 questions by the Liberals were either about Quebec or were asked by MP's from Quebec.

    They can suck up to Quebec all they want, it'll take Quebecers 2 or 3 more elections at least before they forget, or forgive, the Liberals for the odiousness that was Adscam.

    • If an off the cuff comment on arts funding cost Harper 5 to 10 seats in Quebec last election, the accusation, buy their number 1 organizer in Quebec, that the current Liberal Party is run by folks in Toronto will not be a neutral event. The more they try to suck up to Quebec, the more damage they will do to themselves in the rest of the country and it is highly unlikely Quebecers will respond to this obvious pandering.

      • It seems like a calculated attempt by Coderre to cause as much damage in Quebec as possible. Coyne's "suicide bombing" analogy is apt. There is no way that Coderre will ever be taken seriously as a future leadership candidate after this vindictive stunt.

        • The question now is, like Jean Lapierre, would Coderre be talking to the Bloc……if he is falling back on tribal explainaions it might be the best place for him.

          • if that's the case, the best thing for the Liberals, and Canada is to be rid of Coderre. Attacking other provinces is not the best way to win over Canada.

            Perhaps this will be a case for really cleaning house and my even end up a positive.

            Coderre is a goon – I don't even understand why the BLOC would want him.

    • And this would be a realy good time to table the bill giving Ontario, Alberta and BC more seats in parliament.
      Watch Liberals dancing on both sides of that fence will be entertaining.

  16. Oh, forgot previous stabbings.
    Martin stabs Chretien, Chretien stabs Martin, repeat many times,
    LPC stabs Martin, MI and Rae both lose Lib leadership race, LPC and MI and Coderre stab Dion, MI manipulates Rae and Domie out.

  17. Couldn't they just have demoted him to be the Quebec Private?

  18. And it's not even the Ides of March.

  19. Michael Harris talks to Darryl Bricker of Ipsos-Reid, who speculates about fallout from Codere:
    Lib MPs crossing the floor, Layton pulling the plug if Lib poll numbers stay below 30, stuff like that.

    Listen Here

    Fast forward to the 1 hour, 11 minute mark.

    • That was interesting, Interesting scenario, pretty unlikely for the moment….but then again who would have imagined what happened when the Bloc formed. They keystone is someone like Cotler. If Cotler ever moved to be an independent or a Con then the Liberal Party falls apart with MPS flowing to all three additional parties.

      Not saying this is likely, but that is how it would work. That it is even a remote possibility says just about everything.

  20. well put AC. my only question surrounds his remaining an MP….why doesn't iggy push him out the door if he is so pissed

    • Coderre would LOVE that. And so would the Bloc.

      • As far as Coderre oh well. As far as the Bloc, sure, but I suspect the smile on their face is fairly wide as it stands now. and, the message would have to be delivered in the right manner by the right individual (e.g., 'we do need soem fresh blood in QC'; negotiate a soft landing for Dion because there is no place left for him in the party; etc etc)…let's be hnest , everyone knows that politic is about winners and losers and everyone understands Coderre just lost, even if he hurt Iggy on the way down.

        • I am not saying that Coderre is any great catch in the long run. But as a signal of disrespect it would be potent. There are more than a few of the managerial class in Quebec whose jobs depend on being the interpreter of things Quebecois to les angais…be they from ROC or from the US. Coderre was in that position, I wouldnt dismiss the resonnance that this would have…whether you think it is correct or not.

          • while i can't disagree with the value of that position, i just can't beleive that 1) he is not replaceable or 2) that anyone would be surprised that when one loses a political battle and than skewers the boss on the way down, that he or she does not get to pick their own punishment (e.g., resign as lieutenant) in full.

  21. I used to say shockingly disloyal things while Stephane Dion was the Liberal party leader too. I was a rank-and-file Liberal who supported Dion, to my discredit. Just about everyone in the party was either saying disloyal things or suppressing the urge to during 2007 and 2008; I disloyally quit the party.

    Can't blame Iggy for saying what everyone was thinking and quietly, or even not-so-quietly, fretting about. Dion bungled everything from lack of language study to allowing Harper to define him to focusing on issues the public wasn't interested in.

    • And, certain pundits at Macleans thought Dion was the end-all and then started to attack as well.

      Harper was pretty disloyal himself – why it isn't talked about?

      Do you not think there are people in the Cons and NDP who are plotting and planning their future as leader? If you don't, you're pretty naive.

      So, we have floods, tsunamis, Iran with nuclear weapons – and Coderre is the headliner?

      Democracy in trouble – the media has to take part of the blame.

    • ANd yet the Liberals wont take repsonisbility for elcting him or letting him run the party so badly there were so many ontervention points but the party did NOTHING, twice (election and coalition)

      Will they let it happen a third time?

    • "Dion bungled everything from lack of language study to allowing Harper to define him to focusing on issues the public wasn't interested in."

      Really? So please explain why it is that we are saying the exact same thing happening to Iggy? Iggy doesn't issues with french accents when he speaks so what gives? Or could it be that the problem wasn't Dion but rather the Liberals unfailing propensity to turn on each other? As much as I have problems with the CPC, you won't find that kind of public disloyalty among them.

  22. Liberal leader shows up at Liberal fundraiser in Liberal stronghold of Montreal. Gutsy.

    Well, it was Laval, but point taken.

    • Actually, as far as gutsy goes: did he speak a word of English? There's your gutsy.

      • Funny thing is, the Montreal stop had been written into his schedule for more than two months. Had he backed out would Coyne or all the parrot CONs be offering the opposite of 'gutsy'?
        It's the reporter's own spin that made it seem like Ignatieff's visit was some kind of march into Zanzibar.
        Seems to me the tiff between Harper and Casey — one of them with a well-established reputation for being reasonable and honourable — didn't raise the cadre of overhysteria that the CONs and con-thinkers have tried to rope this into. But I guess if you want an argument about the mythical 'left-wing media' one only has to read how greatly the appraisal of Coderre seems to be now in the heights of this hullaballo. I suspect it suggests that they don't believe Steve Clark could repeat his performance of a year ago, or the RCMP is hesitant to offer up a faux inquiry for the masses…

  23. Actually, they really need the money in that riding (Lavel-les-Iles, Raymonde Folco's riding). The Liberal riding association there was almost $50K in the hole at the end of 2007, she only raised $26K for the last election but spent $46K, and the riding's 2008 return is still not posted at Elections Canada. This is one of the MPs Coderre wanted to push out last week.

    • Ya, but that is not exciting enough to go into to make a headline. And, perhaps Ignatieff was also using the time to speak to others inside the party?

      Imagine – Ignatieff was helping a fellow Liberal to raise funds – the horror.

  24. It seems to me this "tradition" of apponting Quebec Lieutenants with the authority to select candidates is a recipe for disaster. Can it be anything but?

    Perhaps it is time for rank and file Liberals to retake their party from the backroom types and restore some democracy to the party. They would do us all a favor.

    While I understand the need for Leaders to retain a "notwithstanding clause" with respect to candidate appointments, this power should only be used in the rarest of circumstances, and certainly not as it is used these days.

    Surely a riding like Outremont has a membership robust enough to sustain some good old fashioned democracy, no?

    • You make a number of excellent points and it's hard to disagree with anything you've said.

      That said, the culture of the Liberal Party of Canada has always been a top down – this has been fostered, or become entrenched, because of there history of being in power. The "grassroots". the rank and file are used for photo ops. The Liberal Party of Canada is the party of the vested interests. You need go no further than the recent feud involving Coderre and Cauchon. Cauchon belongs to the Desmarais Power Corp. clan, (he once was a butler at the Desmarais home). When that clan wants something, they go out and take it.

      So although your points are well taken, the problem is that there is no grassroots in the Liberal Party to take back the party from the backroom corporate crowd that runs the Liberal Party.

  25. Taking orders from a boss has sweet piss all to do with credibility and everything to do with the worst form of pride.

  26. Taking orders from a boss has sweet piss all to do with credibility. Lots of people do it all day every day. Taking exception to having to has everything to do with the worst form of pride.

  27. In the Jane Taber article linked above under Upperdate there's another picture of Iggy's pointing his finger at something.

    I always wondered why in so many pictures Iggy appears to be pointing his finger.

    I think I finally get it: he's gesturing inquisitively as to where the exit door is.

    • Give your head a shake – out of probably thousands of pictures – they deliberately pick ones like that. They've done it to Harper as well.

      Hardly a serious point.

      • I am more shocked that jarrid actually tortures himself by reading anything Taber produces.

  28. New CROP poll out in Quebec and it's grim news for the Liberals. The worst of it is that, according to the pollster: they DON'T take into account Coderre's recent resignation and the ensuing fallout. The poll was conducted from Sept. 17th to 27th. Here's the results:

    BQ 33
    Libs 26
    Cons 21
    NDP 13

    To put things in perspective the Liberals were riding high at 35% in June of this year. Dion got 26% of the vote in 2008.

    • Hey jarrid, you're making a mess on the keyboard with your self-engrossed excitement…

      You bring up Adscam ad nauseum, but the scale doesn't even approach the what is going on with Harper's Orwellian "Economic Action! Plan". Funny no CPC supporter ever complained about Quebec's tax rebate either…

    • Correction: Dion got 24% last election.

  29. All the more reason for Harper to pull the plug on himself, no? Go ahead, Steve, make our day.

    • Is it any wonder Chantal Hébert dubbed the Liberals " Le parti des masochistes" on her blog yesterday?

  30. Disclosure: I don't like Denis Coderre.

    It is a testament to Denis Coderre's personal power base (independent of the Desmarais old guard) that he can knife the leader in the front in public, and nobody says anything bad about him or kicks him out of the party. He is the Liberal Party in Quebec outside the safe havens in Montreal, because he is the person who has been doing the work.

  31. This is my favourite line of the year:
    "The idea that this party is managed out of Toronto makes me laugh," Ignatieff told reporters in Ottawa. "And it makes people laugh in British Columbia, it makes them laugh in Alberta and it makes them laugh in the Atlantic provinces."
    I hope he ended it holding his belly and forcing a high pitched laugh while discreetly waving at his entourage to start laughing. I keep saying it to myself in the Ignatieff voice. Brilliant. What could show that you are in touch with Canadians outside Toronto better than randomly naming the regions of Canada?

  32. It says 56 comments but none are appearing on my screen.

    How did I know your upperdate would be written by Taber before clicking through to Globe article. Is Taber consider a journo or a stenographer? You know Taber is doing little more than transcribing what someone said to her when the opening para makes it seem like Iggy is heroic for turning up at a Lib fundraiser.

    I have not been impressed, overall, with msm effort to cover Coderre kerfuffle. Two angles that I am interested in but have not see covered: how are the 'star' candidates that Coderre recruited reacting to this scandal, are they having second thoughts, and my mom can't be the only woman who has noticed that old boys network did it's usual thing and shoved aside an accomplished female to bring back a has-been male.

    • I suspect the two candidates are refusing to speak–not a bad thing for them to do, IMO. But I agree, I'd like to hear from them in a gossipy kind of way. The other thing I think has been misreported is the business of Ignatieff appointing Cauchon. I thought the Liberal Party of Outremont did that? I thought Ignatieff called for an open nomination process? But all I see is that he was appointed by Ignatieff. That makes a huge difference for me.

      I'd especially like to hear from Le Prohon, who appears to have volunteered for this other riding quite early on in the process. I wonder if that's because she always wanted this other riding (maybe because she lives there or knows it well or something) and was being forced into the somehow higher visibility Outremont riding. That, too, would make a huge difference to me. Again, I thought Ignatieff had called for an open nomination with Le Prohon's new riding as well, but David Akin has it that Iggy appointed her there.

      • According to CBC, Ignatieff reversed his original decision and agreed to an open nomination.

        • But according to all the news articles linked to in Andrew's post, these people are appointed by either Ignatieff or Coderre and there is no talk of open nominations. Since I'm pretty sure it was open nomination, that strikes me as a particularly egregious example of our media failing us–since as I said before, this really makes a difference in how one sees the story. (P.S. old habits die hard–it's DianeG not DaineG)

    • So when your mother noticed that 'the old boys network' had done its job, did you bother to take her to an optometrist? If you read the article, or any other story that uses the facts based on what happened, and not suppositions scrawled from your CON talking points, it shows that instead of having one person — Coderre — appoint candidates into ridings, Ignatieff has cleared the way for open and grassroots nominations that the star candidates must be vetted by.
      But as usual, don't let facts and reality get in the way of a CON fiction…

      • "it shows that instead of having one person — Coderre — appoint candidates into ridings, Ignatieff has cleared the way for open and grassroots nominations that the star candidates must be vetted by."

        dreidel, dreidel, dreidel. I am sure if you keep writing this kind of nonsense you will eventually believe it. I love being told that I am receiving Con talking points, when I think Harper et al are wankers, while commentator is trying to spin this clusterpluck (thnks Crit) into triumph of grassroots democracy.

        • You're welcome!

        • I love being told that I am receiving Con talking points, when I think Harper et al are wankers

          Reminds me of the adage, 'if you give a child a hammer, everything starts looking like a nail'.

  33. It's going to an open nomination. So the accomplished female is free to run against the has-been male.

  34. When I saw the "upperdate" I immediately thought – this sounds like the "work" of one J. Taber.

  35. "shoved aside an accomplished female "

    Now, this clearly isn't true, as the woman is still running in a riding that she probably has a better chance of winning — isn't she?

  36. A note on the comments, Intense debate seems to have eaten them. Looking into this.

    • Who removed the comments???? I think there is a conspiracy in there somewhere!!! Horrors!!!!

  37. I know nothing about Quebec ridings. I got an earful about Libs and old boys network while visiting mom the other day and I just thought I would pass along one middle aged woman's view of the situation.

    • Well, I think your mom might have missed some pieces of the story because the woman in question asked to move to another riding (where there's an open nomination) rather early on this whole process, and as YYZ pointed out, I rather think she's going to get said nomination.

      Not that there aren't a million things to pick on in this story, I just think "woman shunted aside for old dude" isn't one of them.

      • I like this thread. A bunch of guys agreeing that women have no reason to complain about treatment of Le Prohon.

        The point is that Le Prohon was supposed to be appointed as Lib nominee in Outremont and now she's in different riding with open nomination process. There is also a good chance Le Prohon 'asked' to move to another riding because she was the only adult in the room, and was trying to solve big problem, while everyone else was having a tantrum.

      • I like this thread. A bunch of guys agreeing that women have no reason to complain about treatment of Le Prohon.

        The point is that Le Prohon was supposed to be appointed Lib nominee for Outremont and now she's in different riding with open nomination process. I think it is highly probable that Le Prohon 'asked' to move to another riding because she was the only adult in the room, and was trying to solve problem by being conciliatory, while everyone else was having a tantrum. So Le Prohon gets the shaft for being reasonable and not self-centred.

        • What makes you think such a reasonable person wouldn't get the nomination? Wouldn't you vote for the demonstrably reasonable person? And if you were Le Prohon, wouldn't you like, just a teensy bit, to rub all those manly a$$es noses in it?

      • I like this thread. A bunch of guys agreeing that women have no reason to complain about treatment of Le Prohon.

        The point is that Le Prohon was supposed to be appointed as Lib nominee in Outremont and now she's in different riding with open nomination process. I think it is highly probable that Le Prohon 'asked' to move to another riding because she was the only adult in the room, and was trying to solve problem by being conciliatory, while everyone else was having a tantrum. So Le Prohon gets the shaft for being reasonable and not self-centred.

  38. I enjoy political gossip and innuendo, and think it deserves its own regular column, but what Taber does is far from that. I have no idea why Globe has Taber doing this kind of stuff because she is little more than a Lib propagandist at this point.

    • Yes, all those "articles" about her BFF Laureen and her cats was because Taber is a Liberal propagandist.

    • It's funny, because jolyon dislikes Taber because she's a Liberal propagandist, and I dislike Taber because she's a Tory propagandist!

      At the very least we agree that people everywhere should stop listening to Jane Taber!

      • I have no idea how you can think Taber is Con propagandist unless you think Taber makes Libs look bad, which indirectly helps Cons.

  39. Iggy went all in with his election gamble. And it looks like he's got a loosing hand. He' s gone by spring.

  40. "who appears to have volunteered for this other riding quite early on in the process."

    Gender differences? Females = conciliatory Males = me me me

    "I thought Ignatieff called for an open nomination process?"

    Who knows! Iggy has said so many contradictory things over the past week he could be a pretzel.

  41. "who appears to have volunteered for this other riding quite early on in the process."

    Gender differences? Females = conciliatory Males = me me me

    "I thought Ignatieff called for an open nomination process?"

    Who knows! Iggy has been doing much twisting and turning over the past week he could be a pretzel.

  42. Why is democracy failing? Because of hysterical and hyperbolic punditry like this.

    Seriously, Coyne. The political equivalent of suicide bombing? Calm down, dear.

    • Sorry to confuse you. Suicide bomber: Someone who blows themselves up with the intent of harming others. Coderre: Ending his own political career in a mannter calculated to harm the Liberal party. It's an a-n-a-l-o-g-y.

      • I completely agree with the analogy. I just find it mildly shocking that few people of the punditry class are seeing this as, not a terrible shift that will harm Ignatieff's career, but as an actual case where someone listens to the grassroots and the grassroots gets what it wants. This has already created twice the waste of internet space as the Casey-Harper debaucle, which was based on one's lie and the other's integrity.
        But I guess its the ambulance-chasing nature of the business.

      • Its a good analogy.But I thought he wanted to be leader, in the east and west ,we the cow are not happy being lead around by the teat.

      • Remember, Coyne…50% of MacLean's revenues depend on people like me. It's not good to reveal so nakedly just how contemptuous you are of us.

        I obviously understand it's an analogy. It doesn't change the fact that I found yours hysterical.

        • 50% of MacLean's revenues depend on people like me

          Half of Maclean's revenues depend on cranky trolls?

    • Sorry to confuse you. Suicide bomber: Someone who blows themselves up with the intent of harming others. Coderre: Ending his own political career in a manner calculated to harm the Liberal party. It's an a-n-a-l-o-g-y.

  43. The biggest problem Ignatieff faces is that the world of politics is strikingly dynamic, so it can have completely disorienting effects on a methodical intellectual. An intellectual can slowly dissect the elements of a system into his/her own perceived ordering of the world with little interruption. Politics is more a question of learning how to tread water while the sharks are circling. People react in this world in seemingly non-rational ways, especially -for a newcomer – the media.

    This problem is exacerbated by the phenomenon that whenever Ignatieff starts thrashing in the political ocean his 'supporters' are just as likely to throw him an anchor, as they are a lifeline.

  44. The biggest problem Ignatieff faces is that the world of politics is strikingly dynamic, so it can have completely disorienting effects on a methodical intellectual. An intellectual can slowly dissect the elements of a system into his/her own perceived ordering of the world with little interruption. Politics is more a question of learning how to tread water while the sharks are circling.

    This problem is exacerbated by the phenomenon that whenever Ignatieff starts thrashing in the political ocean his 'supporters' are just as likely to throw him an anchor, as they are a lifeline.

  45. zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

    • having to think puts you to sleep? Or is it narcolepsy?

  46. So you dont think the Libs are controlled from Toronto. Every other Canadian outside of southern Ontario does. Ant it is true!

  47. The damage has been done, once again we are left to wonder if Iggy is a PM material and he clearly is not ,and it truly is scary to have him run this country, the libs need to regroup and start from scratch, who cares about getting power right now, build a better party!!!!

  48. dennis is like any of these other corrupted poiticians these days.

  49. The Igneutered One is all but mounted on the Parliamentary wall. He's already made the round-trip to the Tory Taxidermist. Rendered politically impotent by his own words of self-condemnation and his misadventureous foray into the Canadian landscape he knew very little about, I believe the fat lady is about to sing.

  50. The only bad things about this is that it could increase Bloc support which is NEVER A GOOD THING!

  51. Coderre did the right move, it's the move that will get him re-elected. People who stand up for themselves are appreciated in Quebec.

    Iggy's intervention on the Outremont riding was innapropriate after some Toronto MPs told him that Cauchon was better. It doesn't look right when Ontario liberals manage Quebec liberal affairs. That's a bad sign for Iggy because nobody like flip-floppers.

    I personally like Cauchon, but Coderre, as the Quebec Lieutenant, was made a fool in front of his troops and he did the right thing by not accepting to "walk with his tail between his legs".

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